How the he** did we get to the point where statues of our first Prime Minister are being pulled down while parks are dedicated to the founder of a foreign country with values completely opposed to Canada?
In May, 2018 politicians dedicated a park in Winnipeg to Muhammad Ali Jinnah – the founder of Pakistan.
So, this is where we are in 2018: The founder of Canada gets demonized by the elites and his statue is removed, while the politicians dedicate a park to the founder of a foreign country.
What an absolute disgrace.
Considering that statues of John A. Macdonald are being pulled down because of so-called ‘historical controversy,’ it is absolutely crazy that a park would be dedicated to Jinnah.
When the partition of India and Pakistan took place, millions of people died in the struggle. Jinnah who led the Muslims is also widely disliked in India, and is seen by many as someone who tore the country apart. Pakistan is also a nation that has been run with values totally opposed to Canada. There’s no religious freedom, no individual freedom, and ruthless Sharia law is imposed. In fact, that’s why many people have fled Pakistan for countries like Canada in the first place.
So, to dedicate a Canadian park to Jinnah while pulling down statues of one of Canada’s Founding Fathers is appalling, and demonstrates the totally bankrupt values of Canada’s political elites.
Taken from spencerfernando.com
Article: JINNAH PARK: While Leftist Elites Pull Down John A. Macdonald, Politicians Name Winnipeg Park For The Founder Of Pakistan
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Ken Warren - 6 years ago
Sir John A. Macdonald was stabbed in the back by a racist, cruel and/or pedophile clergy. In 1879, Macdonald's government allowed church's, at their urging, to conduct language schools wherein indigenous children could come for free room and board, or just lessons and live at their own homes. The churches found that children who returned to their homes after classes were much slower than those who boarded, so they pressured the federal government to make boarding at residential schools a must for all indigenous children. In 1884, the government relented, trusting that the clergy was being forthright and honest. These were busy years for Sir John A. The CPR was being built across Canada. The western prairies were coming alive with immigration. Warring First Nations fighters were being settled onto reservations, and Metis were uprising under Riel. Macdonald created the North West Mounted Police to deal with the uprisings and by 1891 he was dead. He didn't know that so many in the clergy were racist, cruel and pedophiles. SO WHY BLAME HIM? For the next 90 years -- all the way to 1984, indigenous children have been sexually and mentally harrassed. Does that mean we should castigate all Prime Ministers from 1891 to 1984 ? Indigenous adults in Canadian society should be made aware of the fact that more than half of non-indigenous Canadian children have also been sexually exploited.
Carol - 6 years ago
I'm descended from the best student at a residential school for children of mixed indigenous and European heritage. That's one reason why I neither idealize nor demonize any culture.
In the Vancouver Airport, there's a beautiful solid jade carving of Haida people riding a canoe. Who realizes that the Haida nation were slavers, as were other indigenous peoples--and as my European ancestors also enslaved neighbouring tribes not so much earlier in history? The story of conquest, slavery, and exploitation is universal. We humans just aren't that nice. There's a reason why our species got to the top of the food chain.
Rather than demonize someone whose contributions outweigh the prejudices he shared with others of his time, let's look at how OUR culture, today, exists with more slaves in the world than ever before in human history. Let's erect a monument to the horribly abused people overseas who catch our prawns or put together our smart phones and computers. I'm sick of this moralistic posturing by a culture (today's) that's no better than what went before.
jack skruch - 6 years ago
wow.... i'm embarressed to be canadian....the times at that time were appropriate not now....i'm not a white apologetic for things in the past...i'm a white person trying to make a good living. embrace values for all not just, mine own, but of all. as the great Penn jilette said," My whole take on Libertarianism is simply , I don't know what's best for other people"
Mel Brotzel - 6 years ago
What is it we are trying to do, change history, can't be done. Are we trying to make our forefathers actions conform to what we accept as political correctness and as it cannot be done we want to tear them down anyway we can? Why is it as Canadians we have this urge to criticize our politicians, sports heros or anyone else with any degree of fame. Is it just plan old jealousy to make ourselves feel better?
Kathleen Clark - 6 years ago
I completely understand the reprehensible historic treatment of the Indigenous People as I do the slaves of the world. No question. However, a hundred and fifty odd years ago (and, let’s face it, since the beginning of time) the world was a very different place. You cannot castigate people, politicians, movements ... whoever because the context in which they were living was completely different. The world view was different. It doesn’t make it right in our contemporary eyes but then these politicians, for example, thought they were doing the right thing. It wasn’t just Macdonald who supported these laws. So this epic back bending PC desire not to offend anyone is becoming ludicrous. Yes. Things need to be changed. However, history cannot. It is what it was. I object to having MY history “removed” in the form of statues. The man was the first Prime Minister of the country. Get real. People need to get over themselves and recognize what history is all about. We should learn from it but not obliterate it. Others can put up their own statues or mount a plaque explaining his contribution to something that we object to today but you cannot wipe out his other contributions to our counry’s history. Removing the statue is not going to remove the history. I am getting tired about worrying if I am using the right name for a group of people as the PC style changes. Asians, not Orientals. African ... American, Canadian? Not Black. It goes on. There ought to be a book published indicating the new vocabulary. Oh, dear. The fact that someone might his or her feelings hurt. Lots of really horrible things happen out there in the great big world the least of which is someone walking by a statue of one of the Founding Fathers of Canada on the street on his or way to work, a statue which after a while is no longer seen. Celebrate the great actions and indicate those to which we object today but were meant as forward thinking in 1867. Stick up an amending plaque. How long can we apologize for past history? Put these energies toward amending these issues TODAY. I want MY history as well.
Raymond - 6 years ago
I think the John A MacDonald statue should remain where it is always remain I am tired about First Nations trying to change our history to suit themselves I also think let it go now give money to First Nations as they will probably Sue John A MacDonald did a lot of good things for British Columbia but I hear that none of that came up for the discussion I'll take him down the statue we are supposed to live in a democratic country yet politicians will do anything they can to get the vote to fill the pockets with taxpayer dollars
Gail Francis - 6 years ago
I call upon the RCMP to protect our charter of freedoms and our nation against this willful treasonous attack and arrest and charge this mayor for such crime against the country of Canada which has laws to protect against this perversion and abuse of our constitutional democratic rights and national security.
Evelyn - 6 years ago
Take down that statue and I’m coming at you! Next election you are gone. Disgusting. This isn’t my City or Canada. Whatever happened to public debate discourse and democracy that IS our nation’s very heart and charter? On the positive side, this move might finally motivate the silent majority here to finally take action against this nonsense special interest PC that is erodind our country and freedoms.
Jack - 6 years ago
The removal of a statue of the founding father of CANADA by a mayor of a capital provincial city in our country is nothing less than political suicide. This incredibly foolish mayor and council had better take a look at the polling on this, because that is their huge margin of loss in the very next election. Surely there’s a national law to jail these bums in the meantime?
Michael - 6 years ago
The removal of the statue of the founding father of Canada is nothing less than treasonous. George Washington supported slavery, yet do you think in your wildest dreams you’d ever see Americans removing one of his statues? There’d be a war at the mere mention of it. Stick up for our country that our ancestors created and fought and died for, or lose it. Stand on Guard for Thee. Any government that would support such a move should be removed, immediately. I’m disgusted as a Canadian that this is even a discussion. Sheer idiocy and political correctness gone mad - Run this mayor and councillors supporting this treason out of the country or lock them up for treason against our country.
Jason - 6 years ago
Everyone join me in never visiting Victoria and spending a penny there again. Idiots
edward worthington - 6 years ago
If Mr. Macdonald did something very wrong, have you ever thought of forgiving him. What would Jesus do ? He would forgive of course. If you want to live in the past , you will never do anything in the future. Everybody has a checkered past or something or someone who did them wrong in the past. Instead, of crying for special rights and lashing out, why not think of future generations. John Macdonald was our nation's first Prime Minister and I think he did a lot of things right and good. We don't forget who wronged us but God says to forgive and work toward a better system that benefits all of Canada.
Donna Ellaschuk - 6 years ago
I am for the removal for the reasons stated by Unspoken. The statue is being removed, yes, but will be kept and moved elsewhere. History cannot be changed but we can learn from it and do right for those that were wronged. It's more important to try to heal from the past and that involves empathy and having the ability to yield to change. As Joe says above "the world saw things differently then" well, the world also sees things differently now, and it is time for change, for understanding. There are no "victim groups" Joe.....only victims....and most of them have survived things that we can't understand if it hasn't happened to us...let's help them move from being a victim to becoming a survivor and know that they have the support of everyone....
Lorraine O. - 6 years ago
GEOFF YOUNG was the lone dissenting vote from council, in case you'd like to thank him for representing the majority on voting day.
Alan C. - 6 years ago
Sure take it down. Just don't start putting up totem poles everywhere cause that is not a part of Canada's history either then.
Rod - 6 years ago
So Victoria’s city council is removing the statue of Sir John A. Macdonald to appease a minority group of indigenous people and shelter them from this reminder of “colonial violence” [Mayor Lisa Helps]. Meanwhile, the majority of Canadians are to be deprived of this visual reminder that this is the man who was mainly responsible for the founding of this great Canada and the building of the Canadian Pacific Railway linking east and west from sea to sea. A similar statue removal took place a short time ago in Halifax where the indigenous people took issue with the statue of Cornwallis, citing for one thing that he had put a bounty on their heads. The fact that Indians collected bounties from the French for English scalps was not mentioned. Halifax capitulated to the demand and removed the statue. What’s next?
Alan - 6 years ago
Another example of political correctness gone astray,, whether she likes it or not this woman can’t rewrie history. This move will fuel more intolerance.
Dan Scoones - 6 years ago
Why was the statue erected in the first place? Was it to honour Sir John as one of the architects of Confederation, or as Victoria's Member of Parliament from 1878 to 1882? If the former, why is it incumbent on a municipality to bestow this honour? And if the latter, why the special honour for an MP who ran as a "parachute" candidate and who never once set foot in his riding during the campaign, or during his tenure as MP? (Yes, he visited Victoria in 1886, but that was well after his term as its MP.) Sir John's place in history is secure, statue or no statue. Victoria Council has jurisdiction over its own municipal grounds and can decide how it wants those grounds used.
The Unspoken - 6 years ago
I support this. Walk past a statue of someone who participated in humiliating and killing your family, how would you feel? Delighted?? The statue was put by people who did not care about First Nations. It’s time we start showing respect to the community from whom the land has been looted.
Mea - 6 years ago
We are Canadian an democrate country and no one person makes a policy (bill) in parliament, it goes to the House of Commons and needs the members to pass a vote so why is one person in history getting the rap. He is only as powerful as the House of Commons. There has been in history one man making all the power plays in some countries but not in our countries political system, it prevents one person from being a dictor. So why is prime minister taking the fall when it was the people of the time who made the decision.
And in another 100 years the folks then might think we made bad social decisions, why are we not embrassing our history and ensuring we don't repeat them what we see today as a mistake. A 100 years ago the people of the country though they were doing good. Let's remember with each mistake there was also many positives we still benefit from today.
Ro Smith - 6 years ago
What happened to a vote for the people instead of a minority around a council table behind closed doors deciding for us. I agree with Joe ...1 hr ago. History should be treasured some countries have no history.
Typical NDP: no back bone. “Sheep” mentality like the lunatics in the USA.. Why do we have to “FOLLOW” the USA. I DONOT want MY taxes wasted on this stupid Politcally Correct “crap. Wake up BC time for the rest of us to be viligent & let our voices b heard . Why was a. Special council committee secretly formed to vote on this? Why wasn’t it brought to the PEOPLE first .
Time to focus on the next Provincial election & make the necessary changes.
dennis doerksen - 6 years ago
i think it should be moved and put the real history of John A for all to read..for some he is the founding father of confederation for me and others he committed genocide against the 1st Nations.. so like i said lets not erase history but lets at least tell the whole story...John A has a well-documented path when it comes to his racism.. he is the father of residential schools...but some of you will say that was the past.. for the record the last school closed in 1996 in Canada... with respect...
Deb Brienz - 6 years ago
The statue is overdue for removal. True that he lived in a different time. We are now in a different time and can choose to higher the bar and not glorify inglorious acts and attitudes.
Seriously!!!! - 6 years ago
So every generation of any people is going to be held responsible for injustices commited by it's ancestors?
What about the violence committed during past tribal warfare?
Enough of the ultra left wing political correctness that looks to play identity politics and recognise the special interest groups while ignoring the common man.
Democrats in the states are still questioning how a mad man like Trump got in. Its because the left ignored the common man trying to squeeze out some level of respect for himself.
Pay attention left wing, the further the pendulum swings to the left the further it will return to the right.
Please don't do that to the greatest country on earth.
EVA - 6 years ago
YO_Adolf, Hitler referred to the jewish as savages too. FYI..... no statues of him in Germany. haha...
Dave Scribner - 6 years ago
What part of history does Victoria counsel want to keep? I'm betting only the part that keeps them in power.
All this does is upset the silent majority and the result is a Trump like party getting in and taking power next election. This is Canada and our history is what it is, taking down a statue only strengthens extremists views..
This isn't reconciliation this is sucking up to minority, trying to look like you care and trying to erase history. The Europeans,(British) came ,took over and made Canada what it is today. People wouldn't be coming here to live if it wasn't such a great place to live. If your ashamed then move to another country
ADOLF - 6 years ago
Thanks to the print media, the nazis are marching in full swing in "BRITISH" columbia.
Adam - 6 years ago
I knew this kind of thing would start to happen here in Canada too (the removal of statues of White people from history that were "racists"), and surprise, it has started happening! What a coward the mayor of Victoria is to cave to this special-interest BS. Why doesn't she remove herself from office while she's at it, cuz, you know, as a White person, she is by her own standard a "racist". Pathetic.
Gerry Burnie - 6 years ago
Better Macdonald drunk than the wimp in Ottawa, or some Leftist Carrie Nation imposing her personal bias on history. The First Nations got their apology from people who weren't even thought of in Macdonald's time. Moreover, Trudeau gave his apology and exonerated one chief and four natives (who were somehow elevated to chiefs by a fawning media), knowing -or should have known - that they were unquestionably convicted murderers. They massacred one ferryboat captain and eight, sleeping, road builders in cold blood, dismembering their bodies at the same time. What more can I say.
diane - 6 years ago
it should not be taken down it is part of history if we take everything away to please everyone our city would not be beautiful and we would not know about past. we learn from the past. there was kids abused churches too we gonna tear every church down.
Read and Weep - 6 years ago
I fully support removing this "monument". It does not represent the full story, nor does what we learn in Canadian history class growing up (I'm white, non-partisan and have lived in Canada all my life -- just a disclosure to satisfy the racists about to jump down my throat who I'm addressing here).
These comment sections are always rife with over-opinionated people regurgitating the same garbage. You want to talk about "savages"? This right here shows we've not come far since 1867.
Democracy isn't an excuse for white privilege. No one is asking you to personally take responsibility for these wrong-doings, so stop misinterpreting "white guilt" and learn how to take some accountability. Here's a hint: it starts with compassion, not greed or entitlement.
Stop going on about "tax payers money", "abusing the victim card" and "erasing history". THINK for yourself about these issues, you might actually start to understand a little about marginalization and why removing a statue is as important as the economy. Don't worry, no one is here to steal your position or job of 20 years -- unless you lack the skills, then it's fair game regardless of race or colour.
Ask yourself who you're going to lean on when it's YOU out in the cold. Think about it. You're not on this planet forever, so get over your insecurities and bring something of value to the table instead of all this frothing at the mouth. Privileged citizens are making Canada an embarrassing place to live.
This statue represents FAKE NEWS!
LB - 6 years ago
While we can’t whitewash history the placement of the statue at a municipal building (that can’t be avoided for some) of a racist and someone who helped promote the destruction of the native people who share their homeland of Canada is wrong. How is what he did any different than family separation at the US/Mexico border being done today? Yet people support leaving it? He blatantly called them savages and advocated the separation to stop the spread of culture from the parents to the children. Native people were targeted to aid in stealing their lands. (BTW I’m not native - I’m white and see how wrong this time in history was) Forcing someone to walk into a municipal building and see this man is flat out wrong. Anyone who opposes it isn’t looking at all sides of an argument. Anyone who is native and feels wronged is taking one more jab at them and that isn’t about history. It’s about preventing further wronging. They have shared their land and country with all of us immigrants graciously. All they ask is respect. Give them that and move the statue to a place people aren’t forced to go for municipal services. Then people can choose to visit history without getting a pit in their stomach every time they enter a municipal building for services.
gary kehoe - 6 years ago
Any arguments to keep John A's statue would be in vain, because the statue is not what this is about. The unspoken truth is that a small radical minority are revelling in their new-found power over the majority, and will only become more demanding with each tiny success until the real offending party (Western Civilization) is destroyed. Remember, the aim of these people is not to raise their situation, but to lower everyone elses.
Joe Denham - 6 years ago
Majority says no, but in this country the opinion of the majority does seem to count any more.
John A MacDonald wasn't a perfect man, but he was a very important person in Canadian history. In today's culture of "political correctness" some people seem to forget all his accomplishments. Instead they focus on whatever faults they can find, in order to disparage him and justify the destruction of a statue erected to honor his life.
Jack Nimble - 6 years ago
The next item on the mayor's agenda should be changing the name of the city itself. "Victoria" honors a monarch that brought suffering and subjugation to hundreds of millions around the globe. The city's name should be changed a to honor a peace-loving native leader from the 18th or 19th centuries.
Once the first step is completed hate speech laws need to be updated. Speaking in positive tones about Canada's first Prime Minister will undoubtedly irritate and upset someone.
Then the finale: the city council should work on changing the democratic system of governance for electing mayors and councilors. After all, democracy is an invention of the Greeks and Romans - the original Europeans. Let's just have a cage match between the various competitors; may the strongest win!
Once that's finished we can all gather at city hall, hold hands, smoke a few peace pipes and sing praises to the Creator for the new, enlightened political system bestowed upon the fine people of southern Vancouver Island.
OOOPS! We can't have the name "Vancouver" too. It honors a European that brought European customs and prosperity to the West Coast of North America.
And we should also change the name of the entire continent. The word "America" brings up so many bad and terrible feelings for the millions who have been subjugated by the American Empire of evil capitalism and democracy.
Wake up. This isn't going to stop.
Victoria: vote the bums out and put somebody in there that will focus on issues that bring us together and don't divide us by our race, religion & ethnicity. And someone that appreciates the primary legacy we all enjoy today from Sir John A. MacDonald: CANADA.
KAREN R BROOKS - 6 years ago
As much as I sympathize with the plight of the First Nations people, I do not think that the statue should be removed. John A MacDonald may have erred on his decision for how the children should be raised, but it was not his decision alone. He also has other accomplishment of which we can all be proud of, as he was not a "one trick pony". I also feel that the funds needed for the removal, plaque insertion and subsequent First Nations inspired statue, would be better used in other areas. Stop wasting tax payers money!
Shoshin - 6 years ago
The Elder Trudeau hit the nail on the head "Government has the duty to be just in it's own time".
It is not the duty of today's government to pretend that they are more virtuous of those in the past, nor to go about creating new injustices under the guise of "politically correcting" what they believe are past wrongs, done by people long dead to other people long dead.
All because ones ancestors suffered a horrendous fate? All of us have ancestors that suffered a horrendous fate. It is the history of the humanity. The playing of the Victim Card has to stop; all it is is a license to create more dissension as there is no end to who can claim to be most aggrieved. Today's victim becomes tomorrow's bully.
Pawel - 6 years ago
This counselors in City Hall is bunch of hypocrites better do your job and leave history you do not know to be a history.They are like authority in former communist countries.We chose you to serve not to rule end screw.
BIG TAM - 6 years ago
Canada's Black History? Canada should no longer apologize to anyone. Perhaps Canada should get an apology from Japan for the treatment of their prisoner's of war. China should be ashamed of themselves for treating their own people in a very disdain manner. Canada is a very kind country, often more kind to other countries i.e. Our P.M. turns away financial aid offerings but then again has no problem giving the tax payer's money away freely. How can anyone point a finger at a man and his intentions when they didn't know him?
Dorothy MCCuaig - 6 years ago
Keeping the statue of John A MacDonald on display should serve to remind us of our black history not only to Our First Nations people but also to the Chinese who were treated as slaves to build the railroad. We need to keep our history and all of our MISTAKES alive so that we can learn from them and NEVER repeat them
John Irving - 6 years ago
What will we denigrate next in the name of political correctness? The history of Canada is a reflection of the evolution of Humanity.
BIGTAM - 6 years ago
The Victoria council is more interested in protecting the city's Gary Oak trees than they are in protecting the culture and people who played a major role in making this great country what it is today. Should we as a nation continue to apologize for what happened and what is now out of our control. I'm certain Sir John A. MacDonald was thinking at the time what was in the best interest of the people. Here we have a bunch of politicians trying to reinvent the wheel by pointing accusations at a man and making statements that are inappropriate and false. The mayor and possibly most of the council won't be voted in next election by being a patsy. We may as well just pack our bags and give them the keys. I believe in equality, no special benefits or conditions regardless of where you were born or from. Being equal, being paid for an honest days work regardless of gender, color of skin. Not being bled to death by descendants who continue to think this is their land and are owed special favors i.e. no tax, large payments, allotted land, fishing rights etc etc. It time Canada as a nation woke up and said Enough is Enough!
Steven - 6 years ago
Well, the poll ought to give the SJW an idea of what’s on the public’s mind. But Nooooooo! They’ll attempt to plough through with this egregious, lazy and simple minded project. For the love of God people ! This is Canada’s First Prime Minister!! You want to be justifiably angry about something ? Try contemplating why and how our current fancy socks PM (Who couldn’t hold a candle to Sir John A.) is doing to this country.....here’s an indelible thought and imagine... Sir John A. all gussied up in Indian attire. No? President Shri Ram Nath Kovind, didn’t exactly take the time to greet him at the airport with his patented “Bear Hug” did he? When he finally did, it seemed to me that our PM acted like someone who was feeling “validated” Really? He is supposed to be the PM of the Greatest Country in the World ! Not enough for you? How about embarrassing this country when HE, on behalf of YOU! expressed sympathy on the passing of Fidel Castro ? (You can’t seriously square that circle can you?) How about we think on negotiation skills for a moment.... would you rather a leader who brought this nation together nail by nail, nay sayer by nay sayer or, one that doesn’t have the sense or courtesy to attend what was to be the ratification of the TPP deal? Shall I go on? How about travelling to China only to be ignored and rebuffed due to the pompous virtue signalling that he attempted to ram down the throat of Xi Jinping, the President of the PRC? A government that he himself said that he admired? (His words, not mine) This SJW madness of kowtowing to every group, association or committee with an agenda has got to stop! You want an apology? Okay.... We’re all SORRY ! It was done in the context of the best motivations of the day... we’ll learn and grow.... But let us not ignor the goodness and achievements of our forefathers...
gw - 6 years ago
Compare this to USA removing a statue of their G Washington, a politically correct stunt is all this represents, and not the heart of the country. Who's next?
Vinnie - 6 years ago
Who the hell do they think they are? ( City Counsel ) Sir John A. MacDonald is a founding member of this country. She ( Lisa Helps ) and her counsel are nothing but locally elected officials. How dare they make such decisions on behalf of British Columbians and Canadians. They should stick to local politics such as Sewage treatment plants, removing tent cities, etc....
Ed - 6 years ago
elect NAZIS and this is what you get,...free speech will be next to go ..political correctness will ruin Canada...so are retards should just all resign and let the so called natives run the city..here in Toronto the council is controlled by black lives matter and crime is at a historic high..mind you the do nothing trough feeders on victoria council would never give up their free ride
Ron English - 6 years ago
You can’t change history .Nor should we try .I sugest Lisa Helps should look at the poll to see how well she will do the next election.
BigTam - 6 years ago
So what are they going to do? Put up a statue of Jeronimo LOL -God said to the Indians - Don't do anything until I return and that's exactly what they have done - Tragic!
Bruce - 6 years ago
Only a weak, dishonest, and feminist Prime Minister would allow the statue of Canada’s first prime minister to be taken down! Maybe one day sonny boy will see his daddy’s statue taken down for all his mistakes !!
Cherryl Katnich - 6 years ago
Stop whitewashing history. We want to know the good, the bad and the ugly
Brian - 6 years ago
Another Politically IN CORRECT minority group trying to ERASE Canadian history... if not for SIR John A Macdonald we may not even be having this ridiculous conversation, BC could easily be part of the U.S. if the CP railway had not been built to secure the British Colony from the Yankees !!! Historical FACT !!!!!
Donald Voigt - 6 years ago
What kind of idiot council removes a statue of one of our founding fathers ?
Marjorie Browne - 6 years ago
At that time, calling Indians savages, was probably true. They were fighting for their own lives. Instead of getting rid of Macdonald's statue, why not put up another statue of the Indian Chief across from Macdonald. Maybe that would show acceptance.
MR JKP - 6 years ago
How bout our government focus on creating jobs. Lower taxes. Affordable housing. Better education for kids/young adults. That’s better place to put your efforts.
Mr JKP - 6 years ago
Trading one history for another. Killing all the rights our veterans WHITE..BKACKNATIVE combined have died for.
Joe Bowen - 6 years ago
This makes me sick. I've had it with "victim" groups ruling the world. Everyone is so afraid to speak up that we have been run over by these groups. The past few years people have tried to speak out only to be labelled racist or hateful, ironically by seething left wing protestors.
This man was a great man. He was the first president of Manufacturers Life and the first Prime Minister of Canada. We should be proud of him, and our history. For one, nobody built residential schools to torture or abuse kids. The fact that some abuses occurred was not a reflection on John A Macdonald's intentions. We should also remember it was another time. The world saw things differently then. We all seem to forget that.
How many generations get to play victim before we get to say, "OK, that's enough. Get on with your lives now." The more you feed this the larger it will grow, until you have absolutely no control over it. I fear we are close to that now.
How the he** did we get to the point where statues of our first Prime Minister are being pulled down while parks are dedicated to the founder of a foreign country with values completely opposed to Canada?
In May, 2018 politicians dedicated a park in Winnipeg to Muhammad Ali Jinnah – the founder of Pakistan.
So, this is where we are in 2018: The founder of Canada gets demonized by the elites and his statue is removed, while the politicians dedicate a park to the founder of a foreign country.
What an absolute disgrace.
Considering that statues of John A. Macdonald are being pulled down because of so-called ‘historical controversy,’ it is absolutely crazy that a park would be dedicated to Jinnah.
When the partition of India and Pakistan took place, millions of people died in the struggle. Jinnah who led the Muslims is also widely disliked in India, and is seen by many as someone who tore the country apart. Pakistan is also a nation that has been run with values totally opposed to Canada. There’s no religious freedom, no individual freedom, and ruthless Sharia law is imposed. In fact, that’s why many people have fled Pakistan for countries like Canada in the first place.
So, to dedicate a Canadian park to Jinnah while pulling down statues of one of Canada’s Founding Fathers is appalling, and demonstrates the totally bankrupt values of Canada’s political elites.
Taken from spencerfernando.com
Article: JINNAH PARK: While Leftist Elites Pull Down John A. Macdonald, Politicians Name Winnipeg Park For The Founder Of Pakistan
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Sir John A. Macdonald was stabbed in the back by a racist, cruel and/or pedophile clergy. In 1879, Macdonald's government allowed church's, at their urging, to conduct language schools wherein indigenous children could come for free room and board, or just lessons and live at their own homes. The churches found that children who returned to their homes after classes were much slower than those who boarded, so they pressured the federal government to make boarding at residential schools a must for all indigenous children. In 1884, the government relented, trusting that the clergy was being forthright and honest. These were busy years for Sir John A. The CPR was being built across Canada. The western prairies were coming alive with immigration. Warring First Nations fighters were being settled onto reservations, and Metis were uprising under Riel. Macdonald created the North West Mounted Police to deal with the uprisings and by 1891 he was dead. He didn't know that so many in the clergy were racist, cruel and pedophiles. SO WHY BLAME HIM? For the next 90 years -- all the way to 1984, indigenous children have been sexually and mentally harrassed. Does that mean we should castigate all Prime Ministers from 1891 to 1984 ? Indigenous adults in Canadian society should be made aware of the fact that more than half of non-indigenous Canadian children have also been sexually exploited.
I'm descended from the best student at a residential school for children of mixed indigenous and European heritage. That's one reason why I neither idealize nor demonize any culture.
In the Vancouver Airport, there's a beautiful solid jade carving of Haida people riding a canoe. Who realizes that the Haida nation were slavers, as were other indigenous peoples--and as my European ancestors also enslaved neighbouring tribes not so much earlier in history? The story of conquest, slavery, and exploitation is universal. We humans just aren't that nice. There's a reason why our species got to the top of the food chain.
Rather than demonize someone whose contributions outweigh the prejudices he shared with others of his time, let's look at how OUR culture, today, exists with more slaves in the world than ever before in human history. Let's erect a monument to the horribly abused people overseas who catch our prawns or put together our smart phones and computers. I'm sick of this moralistic posturing by a culture (today's) that's no better than what went before.
wow.... i'm embarressed to be canadian....the times at that time were appropriate not now....i'm not a white apologetic for things in the past...i'm a white person trying to make a good living. embrace values for all not just, mine own, but of all. as the great Penn jilette said," My whole take on Libertarianism is simply , I don't know what's best for other people"
What is it we are trying to do, change history, can't be done. Are we trying to make our forefathers actions conform to what we accept as political correctness and as it cannot be done we want to tear them down anyway we can? Why is it as Canadians we have this urge to criticize our politicians, sports heros or anyone else with any degree of fame. Is it just plan old jealousy to make ourselves feel better?
I completely understand the reprehensible historic treatment of the Indigenous People as I do the slaves of the world. No question. However, a hundred and fifty odd years ago (and, let’s face it, since the beginning of time) the world was a very different place. You cannot castigate people, politicians, movements ... whoever because the context in which they were living was completely different. The world view was different. It doesn’t make it right in our contemporary eyes but then these politicians, for example, thought they were doing the right thing. It wasn’t just Macdonald who supported these laws. So this epic back bending PC desire not to offend anyone is becoming ludicrous. Yes. Things need to be changed. However, history cannot. It is what it was. I object to having MY history “removed” in the form of statues. The man was the first Prime Minister of the country. Get real. People need to get over themselves and recognize what history is all about. We should learn from it but not obliterate it. Others can put up their own statues or mount a plaque explaining his contribution to something that we object to today but you cannot wipe out his other contributions to our counry’s history. Removing the statue is not going to remove the history. I am getting tired about worrying if I am using the right name for a group of people as the PC style changes. Asians, not Orientals. African ... American, Canadian? Not Black. It goes on. There ought to be a book published indicating the new vocabulary. Oh, dear. The fact that someone might his or her feelings hurt. Lots of really horrible things happen out there in the great big world the least of which is someone walking by a statue of one of the Founding Fathers of Canada on the street on his or way to work, a statue which after a while is no longer seen. Celebrate the great actions and indicate those to which we object today but were meant as forward thinking in 1867. Stick up an amending plaque. How long can we apologize for past history? Put these energies toward amending these issues TODAY. I want MY history as well.
I think the John A MacDonald statue should remain where it is always remain I am tired about First Nations trying to change our history to suit themselves I also think let it go now give money to First Nations as they will probably Sue John A MacDonald did a lot of good things for British Columbia but I hear that none of that came up for the discussion I'll take him down the statue we are supposed to live in a democratic country yet politicians will do anything they can to get the vote to fill the pockets with taxpayer dollars
I call upon the RCMP to protect our charter of freedoms and our nation against this willful treasonous attack and arrest and charge this mayor for such crime against the country of Canada which has laws to protect against this perversion and abuse of our constitutional democratic rights and national security.
Take down that statue and I’m coming at you! Next election you are gone. Disgusting. This isn’t my City or Canada. Whatever happened to public debate discourse and democracy that IS our nation’s very heart and charter? On the positive side, this move might finally motivate the silent majority here to finally take action against this nonsense special interest PC that is erodind our country and freedoms.
The removal of a statue of the founding father of CANADA by a mayor of a capital provincial city in our country is nothing less than political suicide. This incredibly foolish mayor and council had better take a look at the polling on this, because that is their huge margin of loss in the very next election. Surely there’s a national law to jail these bums in the meantime?
The removal of the statue of the founding father of Canada is nothing less than treasonous. George Washington supported slavery, yet do you think in your wildest dreams you’d ever see Americans removing one of his statues? There’d be a war at the mere mention of it. Stick up for our country that our ancestors created and fought and died for, or lose it. Stand on Guard for Thee. Any government that would support such a move should be removed, immediately. I’m disgusted as a Canadian that this is even a discussion. Sheer idiocy and political correctness gone mad - Run this mayor and councillors supporting this treason out of the country or lock them up for treason against our country.
Everyone join me in never visiting Victoria and spending a penny there again. Idiots
If Mr. Macdonald did something very wrong, have you ever thought of forgiving him. What would Jesus do ? He would forgive of course. If you want to live in the past , you will never do anything in the future. Everybody has a checkered past or something or someone who did them wrong in the past. Instead, of crying for special rights and lashing out, why not think of future generations. John Macdonald was our nation's first Prime Minister and I think he did a lot of things right and good. We don't forget who wronged us but God says to forgive and work toward a better system that benefits all of Canada.
I am for the removal for the reasons stated by Unspoken. The statue is being removed, yes, but will be kept and moved elsewhere. History cannot be changed but we can learn from it and do right for those that were wronged. It's more important to try to heal from the past and that involves empathy and having the ability to yield to change. As Joe says above "the world saw things differently then" well, the world also sees things differently now, and it is time for change, for understanding. There are no "victim groups" Joe.....only victims....and most of them have survived things that we can't understand if it hasn't happened to us...let's help them move from being a victim to becoming a survivor and know that they have the support of everyone....
GEOFF YOUNG was the lone dissenting vote from council, in case you'd like to thank him for representing the majority on voting day.
Sure take it down. Just don't start putting up totem poles everywhere cause that is not a part of Canada's history either then.
So Victoria’s city council is removing the statue of Sir John A. Macdonald to appease a minority group of indigenous people and shelter them from this reminder of “colonial violence” [Mayor Lisa Helps]. Meanwhile, the majority of Canadians are to be deprived of this visual reminder that this is the man who was mainly responsible for the founding of this great Canada and the building of the Canadian Pacific Railway linking east and west from sea to sea. A similar statue removal took place a short time ago in Halifax where the indigenous people took issue with the statue of Cornwallis, citing for one thing that he had put a bounty on their heads. The fact that Indians collected bounties from the French for English scalps was not mentioned. Halifax capitulated to the demand and removed the statue. What’s next?
Another example of political correctness gone astray,, whether she likes it or not this woman can’t rewrie history. This move will fuel more intolerance.
Why was the statue erected in the first place? Was it to honour Sir John as one of the architects of Confederation, or as Victoria's Member of Parliament from 1878 to 1882? If the former, why is it incumbent on a municipality to bestow this honour? And if the latter, why the special honour for an MP who ran as a "parachute" candidate and who never once set foot in his riding during the campaign, or during his tenure as MP? (Yes, he visited Victoria in 1886, but that was well after his term as its MP.) Sir John's place in history is secure, statue or no statue. Victoria Council has jurisdiction over its own municipal grounds and can decide how it wants those grounds used.
I support this. Walk past a statue of someone who participated in humiliating and killing your family, how would you feel? Delighted?? The statue was put by people who did not care about First Nations. It’s time we start showing respect to the community from whom the land has been looted.
We are Canadian an democrate country and no one person makes a policy (bill) in parliament, it goes to the House of Commons and needs the members to pass a vote so why is one person in history getting the rap. He is only as powerful as the House of Commons. There has been in history one man making all the power plays in some countries but not in our countries political system, it prevents one person from being a dictor. So why is prime minister taking the fall when it was the people of the time who made the decision.
And in another 100 years the folks then might think we made bad social decisions, why are we not embrassing our history and ensuring we don't repeat them what we see today as a mistake. A 100 years ago the people of the country though they were doing good. Let's remember with each mistake there was also many positives we still benefit from today.
What happened to a vote for the people instead of a minority around a council table behind closed doors deciding for us. I agree with Joe ...1 hr ago. History should be treasured some countries have no history.
Typical NDP: no back bone. “Sheep” mentality like the lunatics in the USA.. Why do we have to “FOLLOW” the USA. I DONOT want MY taxes wasted on this stupid Politcally Correct “crap. Wake up BC time for the rest of us to be viligent & let our voices b heard . Why was a. Special council committee secretly formed to vote on this? Why wasn’t it brought to the PEOPLE first .
Time to focus on the next Provincial election & make the necessary changes.
i think it should be moved and put the real history of John A for all to read..for some he is the founding father of confederation for me and others he committed genocide against the 1st Nations.. so like i said lets not erase history but lets at least tell the whole story...John A has a well-documented path when it comes to his racism.. he is the father of residential schools...but some of you will say that was the past.. for the record the last school closed in 1996 in Canada... with respect...
The statue is overdue for removal. True that he lived in a different time. We are now in a different time and can choose to higher the bar and not glorify inglorious acts and attitudes.
So every generation of any people is going to be held responsible for injustices commited by it's ancestors?
What about the violence committed during past tribal warfare?
Enough of the ultra left wing political correctness that looks to play identity politics and recognise the special interest groups while ignoring the common man.
Democrats in the states are still questioning how a mad man like Trump got in. Its because the left ignored the common man trying to squeeze out some level of respect for himself.
Pay attention left wing, the further the pendulum swings to the left the further it will return to the right.
Please don't do that to the greatest country on earth.
YO_Adolf, Hitler referred to the jewish as savages too. FYI..... no statues of him in Germany. haha...
What part of history does Victoria counsel want to keep? I'm betting only the part that keeps them in power.
All this does is upset the silent majority and the result is a Trump like party getting in and taking power next election. This is Canada and our history is what it is, taking down a statue only strengthens extremists views..
This isn't reconciliation this is sucking up to minority, trying to look like you care and trying to erase history. The Europeans,(British) came ,took over and made Canada what it is today. People wouldn't be coming here to live if it wasn't such a great place to live. If your ashamed then move to another country
Thanks to the print media, the nazis are marching in full swing in "BRITISH" columbia.
I knew this kind of thing would start to happen here in Canada too (the removal of statues of White people from history that were "racists"), and surprise, it has started happening! What a coward the mayor of Victoria is to cave to this special-interest BS. Why doesn't she remove herself from office while she's at it, cuz, you know, as a White person, she is by her own standard a "racist". Pathetic.
Better Macdonald drunk than the wimp in Ottawa, or some Leftist Carrie Nation imposing her personal bias on history. The First Nations got their apology from people who weren't even thought of in Macdonald's time. Moreover, Trudeau gave his apology and exonerated one chief and four natives (who were somehow elevated to chiefs by a fawning media), knowing -or should have known - that they were unquestionably convicted murderers. They massacred one ferryboat captain and eight, sleeping, road builders in cold blood, dismembering their bodies at the same time. What more can I say.
it should not be taken down it is part of history if we take everything away to please everyone our city would not be beautiful and we would not know about past. we learn from the past. there was kids abused churches too we gonna tear every church down.
I fully support removing this "monument". It does not represent the full story, nor does what we learn in Canadian history class growing up (I'm white, non-partisan and have lived in Canada all my life -- just a disclosure to satisfy the racists about to jump down my throat who I'm addressing here).
These comment sections are always rife with over-opinionated people regurgitating the same garbage. You want to talk about "savages"? This right here shows we've not come far since 1867.
Democracy isn't an excuse for white privilege. No one is asking you to personally take responsibility for these wrong-doings, so stop misinterpreting "white guilt" and learn how to take some accountability. Here's a hint: it starts with compassion, not greed or entitlement.
Stop going on about "tax payers money", "abusing the victim card" and "erasing history". THINK for yourself about these issues, you might actually start to understand a little about marginalization and why removing a statue is as important as the economy. Don't worry, no one is here to steal your position or job of 20 years -- unless you lack the skills, then it's fair game regardless of race or colour.
Ask yourself who you're going to lean on when it's YOU out in the cold. Think about it. You're not on this planet forever, so get over your insecurities and bring something of value to the table instead of all this frothing at the mouth. Privileged citizens are making Canada an embarrassing place to live.
This statue represents FAKE NEWS!
While we can’t whitewash history the placement of the statue at a municipal building (that can’t be avoided for some) of a racist and someone who helped promote the destruction of the native people who share their homeland of Canada is wrong. How is what he did any different than family separation at the US/Mexico border being done today? Yet people support leaving it? He blatantly called them savages and advocated the separation to stop the spread of culture from the parents to the children. Native people were targeted to aid in stealing their lands. (BTW I’m not native - I’m white and see how wrong this time in history was) Forcing someone to walk into a municipal building and see this man is flat out wrong. Anyone who opposes it isn’t looking at all sides of an argument. Anyone who is native and feels wronged is taking one more jab at them and that isn’t about history. It’s about preventing further wronging. They have shared their land and country with all of us immigrants graciously. All they ask is respect. Give them that and move the statue to a place people aren’t forced to go for municipal services. Then people can choose to visit history without getting a pit in their stomach every time they enter a municipal building for services.
Any arguments to keep John A's statue would be in vain, because the statue is not what this is about. The unspoken truth is that a small radical minority are revelling in their new-found power over the majority, and will only become more demanding with each tiny success until the real offending party (Western Civilization) is destroyed. Remember, the aim of these people is not to raise their situation, but to lower everyone elses.
Majority says no, but in this country the opinion of the majority does seem to count any more.
John A MacDonald wasn't a perfect man, but he was a very important person in Canadian history. In today's culture of "political correctness" some people seem to forget all his accomplishments. Instead they focus on whatever faults they can find, in order to disparage him and justify the destruction of a statue erected to honor his life.
The next item on the mayor's agenda should be changing the name of the city itself. "Victoria" honors a monarch that brought suffering and subjugation to hundreds of millions around the globe. The city's name should be changed a to honor a peace-loving native leader from the 18th or 19th centuries.
Once the first step is completed hate speech laws need to be updated. Speaking in positive tones about Canada's first Prime Minister will undoubtedly irritate and upset someone.
Then the finale: the city council should work on changing the democratic system of governance for electing mayors and councilors. After all, democracy is an invention of the Greeks and Romans - the original Europeans. Let's just have a cage match between the various competitors; may the strongest win!
Once that's finished we can all gather at city hall, hold hands, smoke a few peace pipes and sing praises to the Creator for the new, enlightened political system bestowed upon the fine people of southern Vancouver Island.
OOOPS! We can't have the name "Vancouver" too. It honors a European that brought European customs and prosperity to the West Coast of North America.
And we should also change the name of the entire continent. The word "America" brings up so many bad and terrible feelings for the millions who have been subjugated by the American Empire of evil capitalism and democracy.
Wake up. This isn't going to stop.
Victoria: vote the bums out and put somebody in there that will focus on issues that bring us together and don't divide us by our race, religion & ethnicity. And someone that appreciates the primary legacy we all enjoy today from Sir John A. MacDonald: CANADA.
As much as I sympathize with the plight of the First Nations people, I do not think that the statue should be removed. John A MacDonald may have erred on his decision for how the children should be raised, but it was not his decision alone. He also has other accomplishment of which we can all be proud of, as he was not a "one trick pony". I also feel that the funds needed for the removal, plaque insertion and subsequent First Nations inspired statue, would be better used in other areas. Stop wasting tax payers money!
The Elder Trudeau hit the nail on the head "Government has the duty to be just in it's own time".
It is not the duty of today's government to pretend that they are more virtuous of those in the past, nor to go about creating new injustices under the guise of "politically correcting" what they believe are past wrongs, done by people long dead to other people long dead.
All because ones ancestors suffered a horrendous fate? All of us have ancestors that suffered a horrendous fate. It is the history of the humanity. The playing of the Victim Card has to stop; all it is is a license to create more dissension as there is no end to who can claim to be most aggrieved. Today's victim becomes tomorrow's bully.
This counselors in City Hall is bunch of hypocrites better do your job and leave history you do not know to be a history.They are like authority in former communist countries.We chose you to serve not to rule end screw.
Canada's Black History? Canada should no longer apologize to anyone. Perhaps Canada should get an apology from Japan for the treatment of their prisoner's of war. China should be ashamed of themselves for treating their own people in a very disdain manner. Canada is a very kind country, often more kind to other countries i.e. Our P.M. turns away financial aid offerings but then again has no problem giving the tax payer's money away freely. How can anyone point a finger at a man and his intentions when they didn't know him?
Keeping the statue of John A MacDonald on display should serve to remind us of our black history not only to Our First Nations people but also to the Chinese who were treated as slaves to build the railroad. We need to keep our history and all of our MISTAKES alive so that we can learn from them and NEVER repeat them
What will we denigrate next in the name of political correctness? The history of Canada is a reflection of the evolution of Humanity.
The Victoria council is more interested in protecting the city's Gary Oak trees than they are in protecting the culture and people who played a major role in making this great country what it is today. Should we as a nation continue to apologize for what happened and what is now out of our control. I'm certain Sir John A. MacDonald was thinking at the time what was in the best interest of the people. Here we have a bunch of politicians trying to reinvent the wheel by pointing accusations at a man and making statements that are inappropriate and false. The mayor and possibly most of the council won't be voted in next election by being a patsy. We may as well just pack our bags and give them the keys. I believe in equality, no special benefits or conditions regardless of where you were born or from. Being equal, being paid for an honest days work regardless of gender, color of skin. Not being bled to death by descendants who continue to think this is their land and are owed special favors i.e. no tax, large payments, allotted land, fishing rights etc etc. It time Canada as a nation woke up and said Enough is Enough!
Well, the poll ought to give the SJW an idea of what’s on the public’s mind. But Nooooooo! They’ll attempt to plough through with this egregious, lazy and simple minded project. For the love of God people ! This is Canada’s First Prime Minister!! You want to be justifiably angry about something ? Try contemplating why and how our current fancy socks PM (Who couldn’t hold a candle to Sir John A.) is doing to this country.....here’s an indelible thought and imagine... Sir John A. all gussied up in Indian attire. No? President Shri Ram Nath Kovind, didn’t exactly take the time to greet him at the airport with his patented “Bear Hug” did he? When he finally did, it seemed to me that our PM acted like someone who was feeling “validated” Really? He is supposed to be the PM of the Greatest Country in the World ! Not enough for you? How about embarrassing this country when HE, on behalf of YOU! expressed sympathy on the passing of Fidel Castro ? (You can’t seriously square that circle can you?) How about we think on negotiation skills for a moment.... would you rather a leader who brought this nation together nail by nail, nay sayer by nay sayer or, one that doesn’t have the sense or courtesy to attend what was to be the ratification of the TPP deal? Shall I go on? How about travelling to China only to be ignored and rebuffed due to the pompous virtue signalling that he attempted to ram down the throat of Xi Jinping, the President of the PRC? A government that he himself said that he admired? (His words, not mine) This SJW madness of kowtowing to every group, association or committee with an agenda has got to stop! You want an apology? Okay.... We’re all SORRY ! It was done in the context of the best motivations of the day... we’ll learn and grow.... But let us not ignor the goodness and achievements of our forefathers...
Compare this to USA removing a statue of their G Washington, a politically correct stunt is all this represents, and not the heart of the country. Who's next?
Who the hell do they think they are? ( City Counsel ) Sir John A. MacDonald is a founding member of this country. She ( Lisa Helps ) and her counsel are nothing but locally elected officials. How dare they make such decisions on behalf of British Columbians and Canadians. They should stick to local politics such as Sewage treatment plants, removing tent cities, etc....
elect NAZIS and this is what you get,...free speech will be next to go ..political correctness will ruin Canada...so are retards should just all resign and let the so called natives run the city..here in Toronto the council is controlled by black lives matter and crime is at a historic high..mind you the do nothing trough feeders on victoria council would never give up their free ride
You can’t change history .Nor should we try .I sugest Lisa Helps should look at the poll to see how well she will do the next election.
So what are they going to do? Put up a statue of Jeronimo LOL -God said to the Indians - Don't do anything until I return and that's exactly what they have done - Tragic!
Only a weak, dishonest, and feminist Prime Minister would allow the statue of Canada’s first prime minister to be taken down! Maybe one day sonny boy will see his daddy’s statue taken down for all his mistakes !!
Stop whitewashing history. We want to know the good, the bad and the ugly
Another Politically IN CORRECT minority group trying to ERASE Canadian history... if not for SIR John A Macdonald we may not even be having this ridiculous conversation, BC could easily be part of the U.S. if the CP railway had not been built to secure the British Colony from the Yankees !!! Historical FACT !!!!!
What kind of idiot council removes a statue of one of our founding fathers ?
At that time, calling Indians savages, was probably true. They were fighting for their own lives. Instead of getting rid of Macdonald's statue, why not put up another statue of the Indian Chief across from Macdonald. Maybe that would show acceptance.
How bout our government focus on creating jobs. Lower taxes. Affordable housing. Better education for kids/young adults. That’s better place to put your efforts.
Trading one history for another. Killing all the rights our veterans WHITE..BKACKNATIVE combined have died for.
This makes me sick. I've had it with "victim" groups ruling the world. Everyone is so afraid to speak up that we have been run over by these groups. The past few years people have tried to speak out only to be labelled racist or hateful, ironically by seething left wing protestors.
This man was a great man. He was the first president of Manufacturers Life and the first Prime Minister of Canada. We should be proud of him, and our history. For one, nobody built residential schools to torture or abuse kids. The fact that some abuses occurred was not a reflection on John A Macdonald's intentions. We should also remember it was another time. The world saw things differently then. We all seem to forget that.
How many generations get to play victim before we get to say, "OK, that's enough. Get on with your lives now." The more you feed this the larger it will grow, until you have absolutely no control over it. I fear we are close to that now.