Ben commented that "In the next 30 years Mexico will become one of the top 10 countries in the world.... We are seeing the beginning of this now. Compared to 30 years ago."
Beg to differ. Mexico in many areas is a failed state. Narcos control entire regions. The attempted exodus to the US is ongoing and seemingly endless. I loved Mexico from my first exposure as a 5-year-old after WWII. I have great memories from many experiences all over Mexico in every decade since. Until about 30 years ago, when the drug violence was just too much.
Femicide, job loss to cheaper labor overseas, destruction of indigenous businesses due to NAFTA, murder:
none of the statistics look good. The country is going in the wrong direction. (As are many other nations.)
John - 3 years ago
Living in Mexico among the people has been the best way to know about the country its culture and history. It's always a privilege for me to hear of the local history, culture and how it is to live here. When I moved here I didn't just think about the economic advantages, but how will I contribute to this beautiful country.
El aleman - 3 years ago
Expates are not the ones guilty of raising rents in Ensenada,TJ. and elsewhere it‘s the influx of Mexican people from the mainland looking to work around here.Drive around TJ. and view the miles and miles of new home construction in places where no Expat would want to live!
Lefty - 3 years ago
I have lived in Mexico for almost 16 years....visiting 10 before that. In our town, it was mostly ex=pats driving, with indigenous people walking, busing or even riding horses. NOW - I would estimate that 75% of the traffic is non ex-pats. Lots of designer clothes et al as well - and I don't see anybody starving out there. Some Mexicans are definitely better off from the millions and millions of dollars injected into the economy. Maybe not as "charming" as years ago - both ex pats and Mexicans have better lifestyles. More businesses. More jobs. However, too many of the newbies are a holes, flaunting wealth and expecting NOB services. A 2 sided coin.
Joe H - 3 years ago
Interesting how some here are inclined to speak, not just for themselves, but make huge blanket statements such as "the Mexican people" or "we make things worse" or "what the Mexican people need or want", ad nauseum. If someone wants to posit that they themselves are making things worse, or that they now speak for the entirety of the Mexican people and what they need or want, fine; go for it. Otherwise, it comes across as sanctimonious and to be discounted out of hand. Richard's even handed response was by far the most cogent and thoughtful here and one that I agree with. Best to all and keep on rockin' in the free world!
Alexis - 3 years ago
We spend 5-6 months on a beach outside of Loreto in BCS, along with another 20 RV rigs.we don’t stay in airbnbs we son’s stay in hotels we don't eat at the fancy restaurants. We spend our money with all the locals when we need work done and we pay rent to the local Government of Loreto. We all love the place and it’s been occupied by expats since the 1980’s. And I’d say that over the course of those months we all together spend on average over over 2 million pesos. We have however, over the years seen Fonatur attempt to turn EVERY place that tourist have even gone to, into a tourist Mecca, by selling or leasing large amounts of waterfront land to expensive hotels, and resorts. This has in turn attracted the wealthy who came for a visit to return and purchase their own bit of heaven. As well, many get working visas so they can then provide services to these same wealthy people keeping the money flowing into their pockets and not the locals who are more and more priced out of their own homes.
This is a two sided coin, or a “be careful what you wish for “scenario. If you invite them, tourist will come, and some will stay. Most of us are not wealthy, but can live very well on what we do earn and are more than happy to share with the locals, and as we get older enjoy the warmth of winter there.
Our group finds itself constantly anxious about whether we will be able to return every winter for the last 15 years since Fonatur has spent billions at attracking well heeled tourists to Loreto, Loreto Bay and a fancy resort south of us outside Lïguï, while continuously surveying the land we sit on and trying to sell or lease it to some other fancy resort outfit!
It isn’t just wealthy expats having an impact, it’s the governments own Ministry that is selling Mexico to the wealthy over the needs of the locals. Yes, locals may get jobs there but when they can’t afford to live there anymore or shop there, what’s the point?
RICHARD - 3 years ago
I love living in Mexico. However, using only basic logic it is clear to see that 80-90% of the Expat population living here is not because of the Mexican lifestyle, its because it is much cheeper than living in Gringo Land. The rich stay in the US or go to Europe not Mexico!!!
Brad Boner - 3 years ago
Okay, kids, here are the numbers from the United Nations on where Americans are going when they decide to leave the USA. Listed below, from Number 10 to Number 1.
10.) ITALY - between 60,000 and 80,000 Americans
9.) PERU - between 56,000 and 81,000
8.) FRANCE - between 59,000 and 97,000
7.) SOUTH KOREA - between 67,000 and 111,000
6.) ISRAEL - between 76,000 and 122,000
5.) AUSTRALIA - between 114,000 and 145,000
4.) GERMANY - between 127,000 and 142,000
3.) ENGLAND - between 215,000 and 252,000
2.) CANADA - between 270,000 and 312,000
and at Number One!...
1.) MEXICO - between 762,000 and 900,000
Almost a million Americans in a country of 350 million. Now you know why you always feel so lonesome.
BONER OUT...
Tagz - 3 years ago
Expats do only one thing, spend money, drive up the cost of living, bring bad habits as they feel they are on an upto 6 month vacation, go home and feel they know Mexico. These are tourists who know crap about the real life day to day struggles of the Mexican citizens. The expats drive up the cost of living because they are totally stupid, have no clue about real costs in Mexico, and are so stupid they pay the well known Impuestos Rubio. Gringo’s upset the economy of scale, load mouthed, opinionated, think they can be involved and protest in political matters, 90% make no effort to assimilate into the Mexico community, speak the language, and tend to live within a gringo community. Mexico does not need these ass wipes, they contribute nothing, only pain for the Mexican Citizens. Viva Mexico.
Italia - 3 years ago
Love mexico and hopefully violence gets better too for women and all people.
Brad Boner - 3 years ago
Well, much more could be made of this almost-sentient poll and these soulless comments if we knew the numbers. How many Expats are you talking about? Thousands? Millions? More than 10 million? 20 million? 50 million?
A handful in places such as San Miguel may make a difference to the owner of a local restaurant said to be popular. Overall, the Expat community across the country is negligible. Tourists drop more cash in Mexico in one week than the entire cast of woebegone Expats in Mazatlan spend in a year. Wonder what the annual tourist alcohol tab is in Cancun? Yeah.
Polls like this one that do not offer particulars are useless and annoying. Mexicans working in the USA deliver quantifiable billions to Mexico in remittances (wire transfers). That's meaningful. Two, three, four budget-tight Expats buying basic groceries for the week are bar peanuts in the Big Picture. Heady commenters who focus on the negative impact of ever-angling Expat dollars have a good point. But my guess is that they likely are part of that mess. Frumpy Expats do not come to Mexico to eat beans out of a clay pot. There is entitlement. sure.
But you know kids, Expats living in Portugal, the Philippines and elsewhere are as demanding as the ones we have here. So, I ask you, you air-conditioned, well-fed dilettantes, where's the beef? Picture three/four bad cells in the moving bloodstream of a 77-year-old and you get the picture of just much the Expat means to Mexico - hardly at all.
Boner out...
Steve Small - 3 years ago
Been here since 95, bring about GBP 5,000 every month into the economy from outside sources (125,000 pesos )and every cent goes into the local economy , when I retire I will take Mexican nationality and spend the last of my days in this beautiful country with it's lovely people!
Roger Carlon - 3 years ago
Unfortunately since we have so many expats and others foreigners living full time or part time in Mexico Prices are very high ,and it is making workers wanting more money and less work …since gringos will pay anything without knowing that they 3 times more than a Mexican will,pay for the same thing .
Skooby - 3 years ago
Expat overall are making the already wealthy people in Mexico more wealthier. They mainly congregate in tourist towns going to fancy restaurants and staying in resorts or high end chain hotels and not in the neighborhoods of the people who could actually benefit. They're helping resorts get bigger on the coastal cities and padding the pockets of all the already wealth businesses in neighborhoods like Condesa, Roma and Polanco in Mexico City. And many times they don't maintain the place they are staying and costing the landlords money to repair and replace furnishings, as I have witnessed numerous times.
kenneth - 3 years ago
George/Richard/and Leslie: You could not have been more succinct, perceptive and "More Right On"!
Rex - 3 years ago
Of course it is economically beneficial to Mexico to have young expat population. People coming to Mexico and spending hard currency is a massive short term boost. The key words are "economic" and "short term." Other countries would die for this kind of influx.
Melodie - 3 years ago
I have lived for 15 years on Isla Mujeres.
The influx is slowly killing the island. Infrastructure can not withstand the building. We all suffer together. Lack of water is a major problem CFE comes and goes. Housing is thru the roof. It’s exoacts denands that have caused this. Air B&B killing the housing. Expects come rent for a year. Go back home for 6 months rent their space out and make illegal money while at home. It’s not good for Mexicans. The rich get richer and the poor struggle
George - 3 years ago
Expats do spend money. But it’s just mostly making the rich richer. Regular workers can’t afford to live in towns where they were born anymore.
Richard - 3 years ago
This is a complicated question with no clear or easy answer: On the one hand, an ever-growing expat population can be good for any local economy as they bring their foreign incomes to spend in a country where their money goes farther, but on the other hand, the gentrification that comes along with such an influx of expats can be viewed by the local population as a form of colonialism as they drive prices up so that people who have had long roots in communities can no longer afford to live in them. (Their salaries will not go up at a pace equal to that of the cost of living foreign dollars drive it up). We have to be mindful of the country we are moving to and the people there. It belongs to them - not us. It is not our place to reinvent Mexico in our image for our convenience.
David - 3 years ago
To spend money thinking you are helping the economy is not what the Mexican people need or want. If you come to Mexico to live, do WITH the people, not FOR the people. Mexicans offer the better lesson in what a good lifestyle and family values are than anything expats from the United States can offer them.
Ben Pitre - 3 years ago
In the next 30 years Mexico will become one of the top 10 countries in the world. It will begin to atrack back immigrants and its products will be much respected and like London and New York it will be a magnet for world class talent.
We are seeing the beginning of this now. Compared to 30 years ago ...THANK YOU GOD!!!!
Maria - 3 years ago
Will the benefit out Weigh the problem the expats will bring in ? This always comes with extra baggage’s
Italia garino - 3 years ago
We love mexican sweet people
Many mexican are in california ao we know rhem
Chris - 3 years ago
Unfortunately, a lot of new immigrants want North of the border conditions and goods. They should be told to leave their attitudes at the border. This is Mexico, and their country. Accept it or leave.
Peter B - 3 years ago
Expats make a huge contribution to the Mexican economy..all countries need growth because that creates new jobs across all industries.
Leslie Tabarez - 3 years ago
We make things worse for the locals in many ways. Financially, we cause rents and services to skyrocket and the sense of entitlement many expats have (especially when they feel they are entitled to things just because of their relative wealth) is inexcusable. Many expats continue to spend most of their money at transnational businesses where very little of the money the companies make actually stays in Mexico, except for the paltry wages that brought them here in the first place, and many make no effort to learn Spanish or to become a real part of (and asset to) Mexico. I see many complaining about having to still wear masks (which has done a lot to keep us safe during the pandemic), or about how things are done here, or pretty much hanging out only with other expats. My husband and I LOVE living here, but we speak fluent Spanish and try to assimilate as much as possible. We have mostly Mexican friends, although we do not choose our friends by their nationality, and look forward to becoming citizens as soon as possible.
Ramon - 3 years ago
Let’s not go far to see the impact expat are having in Mexico. Look at Tijuana, Mexicali, Rosarito and Ensenada. The rents are through the roof.
Ben commented that "In the next 30 years Mexico will become one of the top 10 countries in the world.... We are seeing the beginning of this now. Compared to 30 years ago."
Beg to differ. Mexico in many areas is a failed state. Narcos control entire regions. The attempted exodus to the US is ongoing and seemingly endless. I loved Mexico from my first exposure as a 5-year-old after WWII. I have great memories from many experiences all over Mexico in every decade since. Until about 30 years ago, when the drug violence was just too much.
Femicide, job loss to cheaper labor overseas, destruction of indigenous businesses due to NAFTA, murder:
none of the statistics look good. The country is going in the wrong direction. (As are many other nations.)
Living in Mexico among the people has been the best way to know about the country its culture and history. It's always a privilege for me to hear of the local history, culture and how it is to live here. When I moved here I didn't just think about the economic advantages, but how will I contribute to this beautiful country.
Expates are not the ones guilty of raising rents in Ensenada,TJ. and elsewhere it‘s the influx of Mexican people from the mainland looking to work around here.Drive around TJ. and view the miles and miles of new home construction in places where no Expat would want to live!
I have lived in Mexico for almost 16 years....visiting 10 before that. In our town, it was mostly ex=pats driving, with indigenous people walking, busing or even riding horses. NOW - I would estimate that 75% of the traffic is non ex-pats. Lots of designer clothes et al as well - and I don't see anybody starving out there. Some Mexicans are definitely better off from the millions and millions of dollars injected into the economy. Maybe not as "charming" as years ago - both ex pats and Mexicans have better lifestyles. More businesses. More jobs. However, too many of the newbies are a holes, flaunting wealth and expecting NOB services. A 2 sided coin.
Interesting how some here are inclined to speak, not just for themselves, but make huge blanket statements such as "the Mexican people" or "we make things worse" or "what the Mexican people need or want", ad nauseum. If someone wants to posit that they themselves are making things worse, or that they now speak for the entirety of the Mexican people and what they need or want, fine; go for it. Otherwise, it comes across as sanctimonious and to be discounted out of hand. Richard's even handed response was by far the most cogent and thoughtful here and one that I agree with. Best to all and keep on rockin' in the free world!
We spend 5-6 months on a beach outside of Loreto in BCS, along with another 20 RV rigs.we don’t stay in airbnbs we son’s stay in hotels we don't eat at the fancy restaurants. We spend our money with all the locals when we need work done and we pay rent to the local Government of Loreto. We all love the place and it’s been occupied by expats since the 1980’s. And I’d say that over the course of those months we all together spend on average over over 2 million pesos. We have however, over the years seen Fonatur attempt to turn EVERY place that tourist have even gone to, into a tourist Mecca, by selling or leasing large amounts of waterfront land to expensive hotels, and resorts. This has in turn attracted the wealthy who came for a visit to return and purchase their own bit of heaven. As well, many get working visas so they can then provide services to these same wealthy people keeping the money flowing into their pockets and not the locals who are more and more priced out of their own homes.
This is a two sided coin, or a “be careful what you wish for “scenario. If you invite them, tourist will come, and some will stay. Most of us are not wealthy, but can live very well on what we do earn and are more than happy to share with the locals, and as we get older enjoy the warmth of winter there.
Our group finds itself constantly anxious about whether we will be able to return every winter for the last 15 years since Fonatur has spent billions at attracking well heeled tourists to Loreto, Loreto Bay and a fancy resort south of us outside Lïguï, while continuously surveying the land we sit on and trying to sell or lease it to some other fancy resort outfit!
It isn’t just wealthy expats having an impact, it’s the governments own Ministry that is selling Mexico to the wealthy over the needs of the locals. Yes, locals may get jobs there but when they can’t afford to live there anymore or shop there, what’s the point?
I love living in Mexico. However, using only basic logic it is clear to see that 80-90% of the Expat population living here is not because of the Mexican lifestyle, its because it is much cheeper than living in Gringo Land. The rich stay in the US or go to Europe not Mexico!!!
Okay, kids, here are the numbers from the United Nations on where Americans are going when they decide to leave the USA. Listed below, from Number 10 to Number 1.
10.) ITALY - between 60,000 and 80,000 Americans
9.) PERU - between 56,000 and 81,000
8.) FRANCE - between 59,000 and 97,000
7.) SOUTH KOREA - between 67,000 and 111,000
6.) ISRAEL - between 76,000 and 122,000
5.) AUSTRALIA - between 114,000 and 145,000
4.) GERMANY - between 127,000 and 142,000
3.) ENGLAND - between 215,000 and 252,000
2.) CANADA - between 270,000 and 312,000
and at Number One!...
1.) MEXICO - between 762,000 and 900,000
Almost a million Americans in a country of 350 million. Now you know why you always feel so lonesome.
BONER OUT...
Expats do only one thing, spend money, drive up the cost of living, bring bad habits as they feel they are on an upto 6 month vacation, go home and feel they know Mexico. These are tourists who know crap about the real life day to day struggles of the Mexican citizens. The expats drive up the cost of living because they are totally stupid, have no clue about real costs in Mexico, and are so stupid they pay the well known Impuestos Rubio. Gringo’s upset the economy of scale, load mouthed, opinionated, think they can be involved and protest in political matters, 90% make no effort to assimilate into the Mexico community, speak the language, and tend to live within a gringo community. Mexico does not need these ass wipes, they contribute nothing, only pain for the Mexican Citizens. Viva Mexico.
Love mexico and hopefully violence gets better too for women and all people.
Well, much more could be made of this almost-sentient poll and these soulless comments if we knew the numbers. How many Expats are you talking about? Thousands? Millions? More than 10 million? 20 million? 50 million?
A handful in places such as San Miguel may make a difference to the owner of a local restaurant said to be popular. Overall, the Expat community across the country is negligible. Tourists drop more cash in Mexico in one week than the entire cast of woebegone Expats in Mazatlan spend in a year. Wonder what the annual tourist alcohol tab is in Cancun? Yeah.
Polls like this one that do not offer particulars are useless and annoying. Mexicans working in the USA deliver quantifiable billions to Mexico in remittances (wire transfers). That's meaningful. Two, three, four budget-tight Expats buying basic groceries for the week are bar peanuts in the Big Picture. Heady commenters who focus on the negative impact of ever-angling Expat dollars have a good point. But my guess is that they likely are part of that mess. Frumpy Expats do not come to Mexico to eat beans out of a clay pot. There is entitlement. sure.
But you know kids, Expats living in Portugal, the Philippines and elsewhere are as demanding as the ones we have here. So, I ask you, you air-conditioned, well-fed dilettantes, where's the beef? Picture three/four bad cells in the moving bloodstream of a 77-year-old and you get the picture of just much the Expat means to Mexico - hardly at all.
Boner out...
Been here since 95, bring about GBP 5,000 every month into the economy from outside sources (125,000 pesos )and every cent goes into the local economy , when I retire I will take Mexican nationality and spend the last of my days in this beautiful country with it's lovely people!
Unfortunately since we have so many expats and others foreigners living full time or part time in Mexico Prices are very high ,and it is making workers wanting more money and less work …since gringos will pay anything without knowing that they 3 times more than a Mexican will,pay for the same thing .
Expat overall are making the already wealthy people in Mexico more wealthier. They mainly congregate in tourist towns going to fancy restaurants and staying in resorts or high end chain hotels and not in the neighborhoods of the people who could actually benefit. They're helping resorts get bigger on the coastal cities and padding the pockets of all the already wealth businesses in neighborhoods like Condesa, Roma and Polanco in Mexico City. And many times they don't maintain the place they are staying and costing the landlords money to repair and replace furnishings, as I have witnessed numerous times.
George/Richard/and Leslie: You could not have been more succinct, perceptive and "More Right On"!
Of course it is economically beneficial to Mexico to have young expat population. People coming to Mexico and spending hard currency is a massive short term boost. The key words are "economic" and "short term." Other countries would die for this kind of influx.
I have lived for 15 years on Isla Mujeres.
The influx is slowly killing the island. Infrastructure can not withstand the building. We all suffer together. Lack of water is a major problem CFE comes and goes. Housing is thru the roof. It’s exoacts denands that have caused this. Air B&B killing the housing. Expects come rent for a year. Go back home for 6 months rent their space out and make illegal money while at home. It’s not good for Mexicans. The rich get richer and the poor struggle
Expats do spend money. But it’s just mostly making the rich richer. Regular workers can’t afford to live in towns where they were born anymore.
This is a complicated question with no clear or easy answer: On the one hand, an ever-growing expat population can be good for any local economy as they bring their foreign incomes to spend in a country where their money goes farther, but on the other hand, the gentrification that comes along with such an influx of expats can be viewed by the local population as a form of colonialism as they drive prices up so that people who have had long roots in communities can no longer afford to live in them. (Their salaries will not go up at a pace equal to that of the cost of living foreign dollars drive it up). We have to be mindful of the country we are moving to and the people there. It belongs to them - not us. It is not our place to reinvent Mexico in our image for our convenience.
To spend money thinking you are helping the economy is not what the Mexican people need or want. If you come to Mexico to live, do WITH the people, not FOR the people. Mexicans offer the better lesson in what a good lifestyle and family values are than anything expats from the United States can offer them.
In the next 30 years Mexico will become one of the top 10 countries in the world. It will begin to atrack back immigrants and its products will be much respected and like London and New York it will be a magnet for world class talent.
We are seeing the beginning of this now. Compared to 30 years ago ...THANK YOU GOD!!!!
Will the benefit out Weigh the problem the expats will bring in ? This always comes with extra baggage’s
We love mexican sweet people
Many mexican are in california ao we know rhem
Unfortunately, a lot of new immigrants want North of the border conditions and goods. They should be told to leave their attitudes at the border. This is Mexico, and their country. Accept it or leave.
Expats make a huge contribution to the Mexican economy..all countries need growth because that creates new jobs across all industries.
We make things worse for the locals in many ways. Financially, we cause rents and services to skyrocket and the sense of entitlement many expats have (especially when they feel they are entitled to things just because of their relative wealth) is inexcusable. Many expats continue to spend most of their money at transnational businesses where very little of the money the companies make actually stays in Mexico, except for the paltry wages that brought them here in the first place, and many make no effort to learn Spanish or to become a real part of (and asset to) Mexico. I see many complaining about having to still wear masks (which has done a lot to keep us safe during the pandemic), or about how things are done here, or pretty much hanging out only with other expats. My husband and I LOVE living here, but we speak fluent Spanish and try to assimilate as much as possible. We have mostly Mexican friends, although we do not choose our friends by their nationality, and look forward to becoming citizens as soon as possible.
Let’s not go far to see the impact expat are having in Mexico. Look at Tijuana, Mexicali, Rosarito and Ensenada. The rents are through the roof.
Will help increase the local economy
I hope not
Expats contribute to the economy.
We spend money