Albert Norcross: See my website lesserevil2016DOTcom/ on how Hillary Clinton would have been more dangerous, and I did NOT vote for Trump.
I voted for Jill Stein in 2016, and in 2012, for that matter. I've voted either Green or Independent (Ralph Nader) my whole life with the exception of 2008 for Obama not out of any naive hopes but to keep with "if the Democrats' stop moving their rhetoric to the right every 4 years, and at least talk towards the left (unlike Bill Clinton, unlike Dukakis, unlike Al Gore, etc) that should be rewarded"
But -- It's extremely hard to think rationally and not emotionally -- bad people CAN be demonized. Saddam was bad, Bin Laden was bad, but to "demonize" means to create a level of hysteria in many, and if not hysteria, then for many others 1-dimensional, caricature, on top of exaggeration that turns OFF rational thought (hence we let our civil rights be taken away, invade Iraq, think killing Bin Laden will solve terror, forget that putting him on Trial is what the families of victims, and debriefing him and History, would have benefitted from)
The media HIDE ugly racism and anti-Semitism by Hillary.
Proof? Sectdion 5 of my website. Calls blacks the Nword and three SIMULTANEOUS pro-Clinton TOP aides testify to her anti-Semitic outburst, out loud screaming "you fcknJewBastard!" --kiss of death if Trump or any other candidate said it, but HRC, gets away. And N-word, yes, so so many witnesses over the years.
And MSM not only tell ugly truths only often exaggerated (forgetting the word "temporary" half on immigration from Muslm countries...which is demagoguery by Trump, but works because of terrified Americans thanks to the MASS MURDER WARS by Hillary)
but MSM even LIES about Trump. Google [Trump disabled debunked] on youtube, shows videos of Trump using IDENTICAL gestures against a 2nd non-diabled person...and a 3rd...and a 4th...including poking fun at himself, that's how he mimics "I'm floundering, don't have a good answer" etc...Media LIED to us on this, on the "Trump attacked a baby" (see interview with the mom or the full orig video) etc. Other ugly things about Trump? Many are true..but Media adds LIES about Trump, and hypes us into being TERRIFIED.
Media also hides Trump's pro-LGBT far more than Hillary (who as a Dem, dragged her feet and backstabbed LGBT resisting until bitter end last minute "conversion") while TRUMP (GOOGLE THIS) WAVED LGBT FLAG ON STAGE but media won't show it. Yes, his position is still far from good enough-- obviously. He did risk by doing this and pushed the Repubs in the better direction, while backstabbing HRC pushed Dems in the reactionary, anti-LGBT direction.
Bigger things? Islamophobia is bad, islamocide!
Killing hundreds of thousands of civilian Muslms over and over in country after country, after country, is far, FAR worse, Take off PC eyeglasses and stop being afraid of what smears may be thrown at you, otherwise you don't CARE about Muslims, if you prefer the mass-murdered of civilian Muslms to being called names for not supporting HRC. Thank goodness I had Jill to vote for.
My site:
1) Civil rights
& Minority rights:
Which candidate's done more damage?
2) Women's rights:
Which candidate's done more damage?
3) Treatment of Muslims
and Arabs: Which candidate is worse?
Who's done (far) more damage?
4) Just who is the bigger
Threat to world peace?
5) Yes, let's talk about Bigotry.
You'd better sit down for this..
This isn't from some right-wing blog..
It's the BBC & UK Guardian; Three top Clinton aides testified!
6) Who's done more harm to immigrants?
and MORE, website: lesserevil2016DOTcom
So no, I did NOT vote for the LesserEvil, meaning I did not vote for Trump..I voted Bernie in the primaries and for Jill in the general..but we got the Less Dangerous Evil, Trump. (And we must COALITION w/DT voters for anti-war and for Fair Trade..dont demonize them, power in UNITY where we agree;we still work on
Todd - 7 years ago
I wasn't going to vote for HRC and Stein wasn't on my ballot. I felt write-ins would just be rejected on so I opted for Johnson who was on the ballot.
Sandy P - 7 years ago
Votes for Jill Stein did not help Trump win for one simple reason: Trump lost. The election was patently stolen. The Electors were idiots and wimps for not backing the people's (apparent) overwhelming choice, for one thing, and for another, the excessive and undemocratic tactics used by Trump's forces to prevent the recounts in the swing states should make it completely clear that those races were fixed, probably in numerous ways. We need to get this: this is NOT a democracy. The media is a tool used to convince us that it is, to keep us busy working within their "system." If our Revolution is to bring back any semblance of democracy, we need to see this clearly.
Deborah E Brasher - 7 years ago
Bernie Sanders' endorsement of Hillary Clinton sent me to Jill Stein. Had Sanders not endorsed Clinton, I probably would have written in his name as the candidate for whom I was voting.
Trina Neal - 7 years ago
I never would have voted for Hillary Clinton under any circumstances. If an acceptable third party choice was not available I would have felt forced into voting for Donald Trump due to a few key issues. High on my list would be Hillary's relationship/stance on the TTP and trade deals in general, her warhawk tendency especially in relation to her apparent thirst for war with Russia and her history of racist actions or at best actions that have negatively affected minorities the absolute most.
Therefore Jill Stein didn't take my vote from Hillary, if anything she took my vote from Trump.
Sally Newman - 7 years ago
Being from NY I thought I could safely vote for Jill Stein. But two days before the election, Bernie sent me an email asking me to vote across the board for the Working Family Party. He cited a number of good causes they had backed in NY and he said that was the party he wanted to work with in the Senate. Unfortunately, Hillary headed their ticket, otherwise I would never have voted for her. She is a corporate sponsored warmonger. I wish she would just go away.
Stan P. - 7 years ago
On the email list question - I find the concept of "sharing" personal information and particularly email addresses without consent to be highly offensive.
If maillist information is given out or sold, it should be limited to those people who have consented to the distribution -- in other words, only people who affirmatively "opt-in" to the release of that information.
Jim Mckeever - 7 years ago
Hillary and the democrats screwed themselves by having her as the preordained one. They never ever should do that and she had a boatload of negative baggage to begin with. I vote for what I believe and I was willing to vote with the dems if Bernie was the nominee. I voted for Jill Stein because she best represented my beliefs, my vote wasn't wasted nor was anyone's that didn't vote within the two party system. If we're ever going to have a more diverse thinking system someone has to set a precedent.
This comment is about question 2 since there is no provision for commenting on that question. I currently receive large amounts of email from certain Sanders connected "progressive" organizations. Every day I receive an email from one of them looking for me to send them money. My take is that there is a large number of greedy people out there posing as progressives who are doing nothing but seeking to enrich themselves off the good will that Bernie created. Are you one of these organizations?
Paul E. Scott - 7 years ago
I believe it is an impossibility to root out neoliberalism from the DINOcratic party. It is not a party infested with neoliberals, it is a party totally committed to the neoliberal ideology. It must be abandoned and trashed.
The word “realism” (or claiming to be a “realist,” in my view,) is just another word for capitulation and acceptance of the options offered by the established ruling elite. It certainly is not fighting for a better and truly more realistic world for all of us. I agree with Richard Peppin that Bernie made the wrong choice in backing HRC, especially after it became obvious that the “election” was a farce, and he was cheated out of the nomination. He had every reason and justification to reject HRC, the DNC, and the DINOcrats and go with Jill. His backing HRC actually damaged the Progressive movement he supposedly backed.
It is not “idealism” to reject what is wrong and bad for the country. That is a phony judgment to justify the fear of standing up for what is right. See Chris Hedges on fighting the establishment!
The battle being waged by the elite has being going on for a very long time. The modern thrust created by Clinton, Frum and others in 1985, (the ideology of the DLC-now Third Way,) had to, and has to, be crushed, and our country returned to the ideals that made this country great. HRC and the establishment neoliberals had to be defeated! Individual battles, like this election, are but a part of the long war we need to fight. We will, IMO, survive Trump. There will be pain and difficulties in the process but with a more aware public and continued actions like that in ND, in many areas, are paving the way to a better future.
Let us Progressives turn to 2018 and 2020 and fight hard to drag the country away from the powerful forces using neoliberalism and neoconservatism to create their ends. We have a lot of work to do and it is the long view we need to understand.
John Woodland - 7 years ago
Voted for Jill Stein. My state will not count write in votes unless candidate is registered. Additionally, my state is not a swing state. It was clear that Trump was going to win in my state and because of the electoral college system, my vote would not impact the outcome. I felt the only impactful option open to me was register my dissatisfaction with the major party choices by voting for Dr. Stein.
David - 7 years ago
Voted for Jill because Bernie was not registered as a write in it's not wasted voted for third party, Abraham Lincoln was a third party independent, so it is possible. The corrupt DNC and there anointed one got bit in the ass for all their corrupt cronies, now we have what we have. Bernie would have won by a landslide victory he filled stadiums, and Mrs Clinton could not fill a school classroom but Bernie and Trump could, so they through Bernie under the rug and shit on him and threats. Live with it and hope for a better 2020 !
Sebastiano P - 7 years ago
I did hold my nose and voted for Clinton because I feared what a Trump presidency would be like and now hopefully my fears will not be realized!
Shawnna Connolly - 7 years ago
I live in WA state and voted for Jill Stein to help build the Green Party. Had I lived in a swing state, I would have held my nose and puked while voting for Clinton.
I'm sick and tired of hearing people say someone 'wasted' a vote; my vote is my fucking vote! I'll vote for the candidate who best represents my values UNLESS there is a need to vote strategically.
Critical thinking will go a long way people.
Albert Norcross - 7 years ago
The results of this survey do NOT encourage me to join your movement. I have heard(for 40 years) all the arguments for and against third party candidates and even voted for one in the 70's. However I am a realist. The country is divided close to 50-50. NO votes can be wasted anymore, and yes, all your Jill Stein votes were wasted. No? Then PLEASE tell me how we are better now with Trump as opposed to Hillary, and don't doubt that our democracy is at risk because of this election. JESUS, I know it was at risk before, but as I said, I'm a realist, and I, and everyone else, has to deal with realities as they are. And right NOW, third party candidates have a snowball's chance in hell. Bernie knew that. That's why HE registered as a Democrat, and that's why I changed from independent to vote for him. You can sit back and be smug about your ideological 'purity' and see how far that's gonna get you in the next 4 years. Good luck...
Like I'm giving my name to polldaddy - 7 years ago
I not only voted Stein but I am now committed to helping build the Green Party in my state. This election has never made it more clear that we need a real alternative to the two Corporate Parties.
Very disappointed to see many people wasted their vote on a Sanders write-in. I don't use the phrase "wasted" lightly because I believe in every candidate's right to run for office and in people expressing their vote as a vote of solidarity... But instead of trying to get another party the votes needed to maintain ballot access in the next election and possible federal matching funds, you used your vote on someone who wasn't even in the race anymore. Stop thrashing about in your rage and focus it on something meaningful. The "political revolution" that Bernie wanted to build was about more than any one person, and he chose not to lead it. Don't let it be anchored down by a failed presidential election. The struggle must continue.
Richard Peppin - 7 years ago
I lost faith in Sanders when he endorsed Clinton. he sold out. He is an "independent" in name only. He should have supported Stein.
Albert Norcross: See my website lesserevil2016DOTcom/ on how Hillary Clinton would have been more dangerous, and I did NOT vote for Trump.
I voted for Jill Stein in 2016, and in 2012, for that matter. I've voted either Green or Independent (Ralph Nader) my whole life with the exception of 2008 for Obama not out of any naive hopes but to keep with "if the Democrats' stop moving their rhetoric to the right every 4 years, and at least talk towards the left (unlike Bill Clinton, unlike Dukakis, unlike Al Gore, etc) that should be rewarded"
But -- It's extremely hard to think rationally and not emotionally -- bad people CAN be demonized. Saddam was bad, Bin Laden was bad, but to "demonize" means to create a level of hysteria in many, and if not hysteria, then for many others 1-dimensional, caricature, on top of exaggeration that turns OFF rational thought (hence we let our civil rights be taken away, invade Iraq, think killing Bin Laden will solve terror, forget that putting him on Trial is what the families of victims, and debriefing him and History, would have benefitted from)
The media HIDE ugly racism and anti-Semitism by Hillary.
Proof? Sectdion 5 of my website. Calls blacks the Nword and three SIMULTANEOUS pro-Clinton TOP aides testify to her anti-Semitic outburst, out loud screaming "you fcknJewBastard!" --kiss of death if Trump or any other candidate said it, but HRC, gets away. And N-word, yes, so so many witnesses over the years.
And MSM not only tell ugly truths only often exaggerated (forgetting the word "temporary" half on immigration from Muslm countries...which is demagoguery by Trump, but works because of terrified Americans thanks to the MASS MURDER WARS by Hillary)
but MSM even LIES about Trump. Google [Trump disabled debunked] on youtube, shows videos of Trump using IDENTICAL gestures against a 2nd non-diabled person...and a 3rd...and a 4th...including poking fun at himself, that's how he mimics "I'm floundering, don't have a good answer" etc...Media LIED to us on this, on the "Trump attacked a baby" (see interview with the mom or the full orig video) etc. Other ugly things about Trump? Many are true..but Media adds LIES about Trump, and hypes us into being TERRIFIED.
Media also hides Trump's pro-LGBT far more than Hillary (who as a Dem, dragged her feet and backstabbed LGBT resisting until bitter end last minute "conversion") while TRUMP (GOOGLE THIS) WAVED LGBT FLAG ON STAGE but media won't show it. Yes, his position is still far from good enough-- obviously. He did risk by doing this and pushed the Repubs in the better direction, while backstabbing HRC pushed Dems in the reactionary, anti-LGBT direction.
Bigger things? Islamophobia is bad, islamocide!
Killing hundreds of thousands of civilian Muslms over and over in country after country, after country, is far, FAR worse, Take off PC eyeglasses and stop being afraid of what smears may be thrown at you, otherwise you don't CARE about Muslims, if you prefer the mass-murdered of civilian Muslms to being called names for not supporting HRC. Thank goodness I had Jill to vote for.
My site:
1) Civil rights
& Minority rights:
Which candidate's done more damage?
2) Women's rights:
Which candidate's done more damage?
3) Treatment of Muslims
and Arabs: Which candidate is worse?
Who's done (far) more damage?
4) Just who is the bigger
Threat to world peace?
5) Yes, let's talk about Bigotry.
You'd better sit down for this..
This isn't from some right-wing blog..
It's the BBC & UK Guardian; Three top Clinton aides testified!
6) Who's done more harm to immigrants?
and MORE, website: lesserevil2016DOTcom
So no, I did NOT vote for the LesserEvil, meaning I did not vote for Trump..I voted Bernie in the primaries and for Jill in the general..but we got the Less Dangerous Evil, Trump. (And we must COALITION w/DT voters for anti-war and for Fair Trade..dont demonize them, power in UNITY where we agree;we still work on
I wasn't going to vote for HRC and Stein wasn't on my ballot. I felt write-ins would just be rejected on so I opted for Johnson who was on the ballot.
Votes for Jill Stein did not help Trump win for one simple reason: Trump lost. The election was patently stolen. The Electors were idiots and wimps for not backing the people's (apparent) overwhelming choice, for one thing, and for another, the excessive and undemocratic tactics used by Trump's forces to prevent the recounts in the swing states should make it completely clear that those races were fixed, probably in numerous ways. We need to get this: this is NOT a democracy. The media is a tool used to convince us that it is, to keep us busy working within their "system." If our Revolution is to bring back any semblance of democracy, we need to see this clearly.
Bernie Sanders' endorsement of Hillary Clinton sent me to Jill Stein. Had Sanders not endorsed Clinton, I probably would have written in his name as the candidate for whom I was voting.
I never would have voted for Hillary Clinton under any circumstances. If an acceptable third party choice was not available I would have felt forced into voting for Donald Trump due to a few key issues. High on my list would be Hillary's relationship/stance on the TTP and trade deals in general, her warhawk tendency especially in relation to her apparent thirst for war with Russia and her history of racist actions or at best actions that have negatively affected minorities the absolute most.
Therefore Jill Stein didn't take my vote from Hillary, if anything she took my vote from Trump.
Being from NY I thought I could safely vote for Jill Stein. But two days before the election, Bernie sent me an email asking me to vote across the board for the Working Family Party. He cited a number of good causes they had backed in NY and he said that was the party he wanted to work with in the Senate. Unfortunately, Hillary headed their ticket, otherwise I would never have voted for her. She is a corporate sponsored warmonger. I wish she would just go away.
On the email list question - I find the concept of "sharing" personal information and particularly email addresses without consent to be highly offensive.
If maillist information is given out or sold, it should be limited to those people who have consented to the distribution -- in other words, only people who affirmatively "opt-in" to the release of that information.
Hillary and the democrats screwed themselves by having her as the preordained one. They never ever should do that and she had a boatload of negative baggage to begin with. I vote for what I believe and I was willing to vote with the dems if Bernie was the nominee. I voted for Jill Stein because she best represented my beliefs, my vote wasn't wasted nor was anyone's that didn't vote within the two party system. If we're ever going to have a more diverse thinking system someone has to set a precedent.
This comment is about question 2 since there is no provision for commenting on that question. I currently receive large amounts of email from certain Sanders connected "progressive" organizations. Every day I receive an email from one of them looking for me to send them money. My take is that there is a large number of greedy people out there posing as progressives who are doing nothing but seeking to enrich themselves off the good will that Bernie created. Are you one of these organizations?
I believe it is an impossibility to root out neoliberalism from the DINOcratic party. It is not a party infested with neoliberals, it is a party totally committed to the neoliberal ideology. It must be abandoned and trashed.
The word “realism” (or claiming to be a “realist,” in my view,) is just another word for capitulation and acceptance of the options offered by the established ruling elite. It certainly is not fighting for a better and truly more realistic world for all of us. I agree with Richard Peppin that Bernie made the wrong choice in backing HRC, especially after it became obvious that the “election” was a farce, and he was cheated out of the nomination. He had every reason and justification to reject HRC, the DNC, and the DINOcrats and go with Jill. His backing HRC actually damaged the Progressive movement he supposedly backed.
It is not “idealism” to reject what is wrong and bad for the country. That is a phony judgment to justify the fear of standing up for what is right. See Chris Hedges on fighting the establishment!
The battle being waged by the elite has being going on for a very long time. The modern thrust created by Clinton, Frum and others in 1985, (the ideology of the DLC-now Third Way,) had to, and has to, be crushed, and our country returned to the ideals that made this country great. HRC and the establishment neoliberals had to be defeated! Individual battles, like this election, are but a part of the long war we need to fight. We will, IMO, survive Trump. There will be pain and difficulties in the process but with a more aware public and continued actions like that in ND, in many areas, are paving the way to a better future.
Let us Progressives turn to 2018 and 2020 and fight hard to drag the country away from the powerful forces using neoliberalism and neoconservatism to create their ends. We have a lot of work to do and it is the long view we need to understand.
Voted for Jill Stein. My state will not count write in votes unless candidate is registered. Additionally, my state is not a swing state. It was clear that Trump was going to win in my state and because of the electoral college system, my vote would not impact the outcome. I felt the only impactful option open to me was register my dissatisfaction with the major party choices by voting for Dr. Stein.
Voted for Jill because Bernie was not registered as a write in it's not wasted voted for third party, Abraham Lincoln was a third party independent, so it is possible. The corrupt DNC and there anointed one got bit in the ass for all their corrupt cronies, now we have what we have. Bernie would have won by a landslide victory he filled stadiums, and Mrs Clinton could not fill a school classroom but Bernie and Trump could, so they through Bernie under the rug and shit on him and threats. Live with it and hope for a better 2020 !
I did hold my nose and voted for Clinton because I feared what a Trump presidency would be like and now hopefully my fears will not be realized!
I live in WA state and voted for Jill Stein to help build the Green Party. Had I lived in a swing state, I would have held my nose and puked while voting for Clinton.
I'm sick and tired of hearing people say someone 'wasted' a vote; my vote is my fucking vote! I'll vote for the candidate who best represents my values UNLESS there is a need to vote strategically.
Critical thinking will go a long way people.
The results of this survey do NOT encourage me to join your movement. I have heard(for 40 years) all the arguments for and against third party candidates and even voted for one in the 70's. However I am a realist. The country is divided close to 50-50. NO votes can be wasted anymore, and yes, all your Jill Stein votes were wasted. No? Then PLEASE tell me how we are better now with Trump as opposed to Hillary, and don't doubt that our democracy is at risk because of this election. JESUS, I know it was at risk before, but as I said, I'm a realist, and I, and everyone else, has to deal with realities as they are. And right NOW, third party candidates have a snowball's chance in hell. Bernie knew that. That's why HE registered as a Democrat, and that's why I changed from independent to vote for him. You can sit back and be smug about your ideological 'purity' and see how far that's gonna get you in the next 4 years. Good luck...
I not only voted Stein but I am now committed to helping build the Green Party in my state. This election has never made it more clear that we need a real alternative to the two Corporate Parties.
Very disappointed to see many people wasted their vote on a Sanders write-in. I don't use the phrase "wasted" lightly because I believe in every candidate's right to run for office and in people expressing their vote as a vote of solidarity... But instead of trying to get another party the votes needed to maintain ballot access in the next election and possible federal matching funds, you used your vote on someone who wasn't even in the race anymore. Stop thrashing about in your rage and focus it on something meaningful. The "political revolution" that Bernie wanted to build was about more than any one person, and he chose not to lead it. Don't let it be anchored down by a failed presidential election. The struggle must continue.
I lost faith in Sanders when he endorsed Clinton. he sold out. He is an "independent" in name only. He should have supported Stein.